POLL: Who here is a member of IMPBA or NAMBA

[Darin Jordan]

SO what is it you are saying?? What rules need tweaking and for what reasons and what desired effect?

Bill... I thought I had previously made my thoughts pretty clear and listed many of the details. Here is a summary:

• Get rid of the P-Limits on cells, revise the voltage to be "up to XX", instead of a min-max range
• Reduce the number of power classes overall
• Add P-Spec as a power class
• Update the LSH/LSO rules, or get rid of them due to P-Spec power class being added
• RE-Write the P-OPC rules so they actually make sense
• Either Update to modern power or archive the Crackerbox and ECO rules
• Either get rid of, or rewrite so they make sense, all the sections that refer back to the Nitro rules, I think that would be a good start. In fact, it would be preferred by me, to have the FE rules be a stand-alone set of rules completely, with no references back to any other rulesets, even if the wording is exactly the same.

I'm sure I can come up with more, but that's a pretty good list.

The desired effect??? Simple... to make it abundantly CLEAR what classes are being offered and to get the WHOLE country onboard with a set of rules, so everyone, everywhere, would be on the same page and running the same equipment... Kind of like we have tried to do with P-Spec stuff...

Seems pretty logical and simple in concept, to me.

[Bill-SOCAL]

You are right, Bill... "hull makers" shouldn't have any problems with figuring out which hulls to make... so if we are talking about just "hull makers", then you got me...

I take it from your sarcasm that I missed your point. SO what is it you are saying?? What rules need tweaking and for what reasons and what desired effect?

[Darin Jordan]

You've lost me now. I thought that was what the length limits were supposed to do?? What further definition is required so that hull makers can better determine what to make in order to stimulate FE racing??

You are right, Bill... "hull makers" shouldn't have any problems with figuring out which hulls to make... so if we are talking about just "hull makers", then you got me...

[Bill-SOCAL]

And my point is that there COULD be if it were more clear as to what classes were being run and what the rules for those classes were...

You've lost me now. I thought that was what the length limits were supposed to do?? What further definition is required so that hull makers can better determine what to make in order to stimulate FE racing??

[LuckyDuc]

Is there any insight as to what rules may be changed for NAMBA in regards to FE for next year?
I for one would like to see the 4S2P limit changed to allow for more than two parallel packs.

[Darin Jordan]

My main point here is that with some few exceptions I do not think too many manufacturing decisions are based on the IMPBA or NAMBA FE rules.

And my point is that there COULD be if it were more clear as to what classes were being run and what the rules for those classes were...

[Bill-SOCAL]

My main point here is that with some few exceptions I do not think too many manufacturing decisions are based on the IMPBA or NAMBA FE rules.

[Darin Jordan]

I'm with you, Rod... That's a much better idea... Could you pass the salt?

[rockwerks]

From an outsiders point of view, an RC'er with little or no boat experience trying to get into FE racing the rules are a hodgepodge of rules scavenged from other areas to try to fit FE into the system.

That is the approach that needs to change. FE rules need to be written to apply to the FE arena or at least updated to apply to current power systems available

[Hydromaniac]

[Darin Jordan]

Okay, so ProBoat and Aquacraft can't move forward with the current rule set. You've told us you don't want to actually change anything. Just re-organize it a bit. If we're not going to actually change anything then what part of the current rule set is holding back Aquacraft and Proboat?

GEESUS TERRY! Get real man! I stated VERY specifically that they CARE about what racers think... I did NOT say they were being stopped because of it... Come on, Dude...

And I NEVER said that I "don't actually want to change anything"... I said the rulebook needed a "complete overhaul" and then had to explain to you what that meant as well...

And the last time I checked, I don't recall saying anything about AQ and PB being "Held Back" by our rules... but rather I implied that, without real classes to target boats to fit in, the "guide" that Mike mentioned above simply isn't there...

I think Bill and I key onto statements like that because it makes it sound like you have the inside track on everyone.

...When you put all your minor points together they add up to a picture that's false.

So says you and Bill... Whatever, Man... I know... I've spent SOOOOOO much time here leading people astray... why should I stop now!

And so lies the state of FE in America... It's firmly still IN THE BOX...

[Grimracer]

Terry.. just so you know.. for me and AquaCraft.. nothing is holding us back (i was not the one that said that) its more I use it to guide my designs.. even that can be tricky.

I did not design the hull on the SV boat product but I did have the MFG fare in the strakes.. WHY.. it would have made the boat illegal. I also checked the free board height just in case.. again.. guide mostly.

As you likely know the UL-1 ended up at 27.25” long. And all I can say is CRAP.... we were shooting for 27”.. long story as to why that happen.. double dumb ass on my part if you ask me..

Its not just NAMBA or IMPBA either.. the batteries I laid out in the manual for the UL-1 are no longer being made.. here and gone in less then one year.. lol

ROCK ON DUDE!

Grim

[Doby]

I can't speak for Mike but I saw a huge surge in people actually racing when the UL-1 came out. GREAT entry level boat with good driving characteristics and respectable speed. For me, it's the most fun class on the water.

Agreed

They are very popular at our club and have a lot of people racing that migh not have otherwise.

You have to get people hooked at this level before they will ever care about what any formal organization's rules are.

[Grimracer]

Mike - Do you have any sense of how many boats you sell to racers versus sport runners? How many people who buy Aquacraft boats are really tuned into the racing scene?

My sense is that the overwhelming majority of FE folks are sport boaters and could care less about the "rules", be they IMPBA or NAMBA.

Hence the 6S SV27 and so on. And I am not saying taht the rules are not worth thinking about, but I just have a hard time believing that most hull and other equipment makers really care what they are.

Bill,

I have a very good idea.. I have been and I AM involved in BOTH racing and designing for the masses.

Luckyduc.. for one.. are there more.. you bet! Just got a call from a FE racer and in passing stated there was a new guy testing at there race pond Wednesday night.. With a UL-1 as a matter of fact.. Hum.. likely many more.. we do sell a bunch of those little hot rods..

Your sense is right.. but that does not mean I have to just care about the sport boater?. dude that’s OLD SCHOOL FE boat thinking… almost RCboat Modeler mentality.. Im not into that.. Lots of that going around out there… they “the others” can focus on that S man…

I dont care what others are doing (not in a disrespectable way) as im busy enough with my own projects.

ROCK ON!

Grim

[T.S.Davis]

Okay, so ProBoat and Aquacraft can't move forward with the current rule set. You've told us you don't want to actually change anything. Just re-organize it a bit. If we're not going to actually change anything then what part of the current rule set is holding back Aquacraft and Proboat?

I think Bill and I key onto statements like that because it makes it sound like you have the inside track on everyone. Same thing with your statement on 1/8 scale. The first time scale was even considered was when it was run right here in MI in 2004. I'm familiar with it. We've never seen a 6s scale. Yet you present it as a matter of fact.

When you litter your responses with things that can't be verified it's hard to just let it go by. Some folks read your posts and think all that you have written is......accurate. When you put all your minor points together they add up to a picture that's false.