Local clubs.......P limited question

[Doug Smock]

As probably the greenest newbie here, I would like to present my experience. I am new to boats (RC in general for that matter). I find it fun and am hooked on these boats. I was interested in getting involved with racing. To be honest, all this talk about class and boats and approved list of specific boats/motors has turned me away. I really want to join in on the racing fun, but find it too confusing. Especially when it came to finding a boat that I could run with folks. It would be awesome if There was an open entry class just for folks like me who have absolutely no idea what I am doing. I want to learn, but at the same time find it hard for several reasons already mentioned here. First it is not easy to find a good boat that is readily available so I can join in. I ultimately ended up with 5 boats in my quest thus far some of which I purchased before I knew (or thought I knew) what the rules were. I ultimate ended up with a Pursuit, Genesis, AQ Lucas Oil, Geico and Revolt as my FE group. Given that only a few of those are permitted as I understand in the P-Limited class. The other biggest challenge for me was the concern that I would hinder other more experience racers or worse damage their nice boats in the process. I don't care what happens to my boat, but I would just feel horrible if I were to cause damage to another racers boat.

Anyways, long story short, I ended purchase a few more boats for my little boy and we end up racing each other on our lake.

Dillin,
If you go check out a club in your area you'll find all the help you need in choosing a boat, tuning it properly, and showing you how to get around the race course.
Are you close to these guys? There are some really good folks in involved with this club. Take your little guy with you and watch what happens.
http://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...y-Area-FE-Club!

[ray schrauwen]

You have a great batch of boats there and only the Genesis has a hard time fitting into a class of racing. All the others have great potential for Spec classes.
Pursuit: P-Spec offshore for 4 minutes or P-Spec Sprint with an approved motor. This can also be used for open P-mono class.

AQ Lucas Oil: P-spec offshore or P-spec sprint cat with it's stock motor or any other approved motor.

Revolt and Geico both fit into the above spec classes too. You could try to run a bigger motor in a Geico for P-Cat (open class) but, it's not as large as some other cats in the class.

As probably the greenest newbie here, I would like to present my experience. I am new to boats (RC in general for that matter). I find it fun and am hooked on these boats. I was interested in getting involved with racing. To be honest, all this talk about class and boats and approved list of specific boats/motors has turned me away. I really want to join in on the racing fun, but find it too confusing. Especially when it came to finding a boat that I could run with folks. It would be awesome if There was an open entry class just for folks like me who have absolutely no idea what I am doing. I want to learn, but at the same time find it hard for several reasons already mentioned here. First it is not easy to find a good boat that is readily available so I can join in. I ultimately ended up with 5 boats in my quest thus far some of which I purchased before I knew (or thought I knew) what the rules were. I ultimate ended up with a Pursuit, Genesis, AQ Lucas Oil, Geico and Revolt as my FE group. Given that only a few of those are permitted as I understand in the P-Limited class. The other biggest challenge for me was the concern that I would hinder other more experience racers or worse damage their nice boats in the process. I don't care what happens to my boat, but I would just feel horrible if I were to cause damage to another racers boat.

Anyways, long story short, I ended purchase a few more boats for my little boy and we end up racing each other on our lake.

[T.S.Davis]

Doug, I expect there will be a good sized IMPBA race in the near future.

Your not understanding what I mean about IMPBA missing out. I only mean that there has been an increase in numbers based on those classes. There is no argument on this. It's real. The fact that we may (or not) have a rule issue doesn't change the fact that we've got more addicts.

The vast majority running them have had a gob of fun doing it too.

[HangTheMan]

Dillin,
If you go check out a club in your area you'll find all the help you need in choosing a boat, tuning it properly, and showing you how to get around the race course.
Are you close to these guys? There are some really good folks in involved with this club. Take your little guy with you and watch what happens.
http://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...y-Area-FE-Club!

Thank you Doug, I am planning on it. Looking forward to meeting all the folks there.

[Darin Jordan]

What are you talking about Darrin?

Nothing, Doug... Nothing at all...

[T.S.Davis]

Now that I think about it. LSH and LSO had a limited shelf life too. Nature of the beast. The tech evolved and we had to adjust. I think LSO was only a couple seasons before brushless became reasonably priced. The notion that a BL motor could be had for $75 was a dream then. I was paying that for 700 motors. A 77amp Hacker esc was $275+ and would go thermal nuclear instead of shutting down if over amp'd before it got warm.

We may or may not be at that adjustment point with Limited but we for sure will be eventually. If we're hoping for a rule set that will hold up forever we need to go back to fossil fuel. There hasn't been a major tech break through there since the weed whip. No offense to fuel burners.

The limited rules were based on what was available at the time that would get guys turning laps with the least effort but still would attract existing racers. It worked too. To win a high points championship you had to run limited to even be in the conversation. New guys were racing against national champions. Both were having fun. Friendships were made. Addictions formed. Even my kid is hooked now and it's thanks to the limited classes. I couldn't turn him loose with a full on P sport.

It was a good thing.

That's the puzzle piece that IMPBA missed out on that I was referring to. Even if they had to throw the rules completely in the garbage after two seasons they still would have had a couple years of guys turning laps, rubbing elbows, and having a good laugh. Can't put a value on that.

[Darin Jordan]

Now that I think about it. LSH and LSO had a limited shelf life too.

Terry... the tech hasn't changed, and P-LTD isn't anywhere near it's "shelf-life" yet...

The issue is making the power system list more inclusive, and easier to "add" to.

ROAR does it by approving more motors every season. Again, it's NOT rocket science.

Our rules would only require a very SLIGHT adjustment to get more motors on the list.

I actually would have expected for new motors to get on the list EVERY year... The list should be growing and adjusting to what is available. Simple to do. Doesn't take a LOT of time either. You know of a motor... I know of another motor... Doug has a couple in mind.

Let's get them listed here and chat about it. Let's try a few, maybe gather some bench data, real data, whatever, and put a list together...

Run them locally for a season or a few races, get the CDs on board, put together a quick proposal, and submit it for a "vote"...

[Darin Jordan]

By the way... not ALL motors on the list are going to be equal. Some will be more capable than others. It's not balanced now... it won't be in the future... it wasn't with LS either.

The key is to get all of the motors into a similar WINDOW... Despite some people here insisting that it's a "1-motor class" currently, those that know what they are doing can pick just about any motor off the list and be competitive with it. Win? Maybe, but podium, surely...

There are a bunch of 4-pole and 6-pole motors out there that are 36mm x 50mm to 62mm out there that would fit the class just fine. Getting just 2 or 3 added to the list, combined with whatever AQ or PB or Atomik or TFL might put out in the near future, would be more than enough to sustain this class for another season.

If we were proactive and had an Organizational review each season of the motors on the list and perhaps what might be added, the class COULD go on for years...

[Doby]

The last two posts make the most sense....period.

[T.S.Davis]

Darin, I think we're on the same page this time. An adjustment may be all that is necessary. The trouble I think will be resistance to that adjustment.

LSH and LSO are kinda still with us. They got adjusted to include cheap brushless motors.

That last batch of Dynamite motors was best limited motor I've run to date. Still bummed they ditched them.

I think what I will recommend to my local gang of miss fits is that we allow PB's new offerings and maybe some others if they're real and readily available. We need an RTR mono like the Revolt. Not sure if TFL can't get it done. It's a delicate thing though trying not to blow out the existing boats. We'll see what works and what doesn't and go from there.

I know some still can't accept that RTR's are part of the "limited" equation but to ignore them in favor of all customs all the time is foolish in my opinion. If we want existing boaters with their own skill sets sure but if we want fresh blood that never thought racing was for them we have to get the RTR guys on the water. Helps to race with them too.

[Darin Jordan]

Some want to "evolve" the class... I'm more interested in sustaining it. It works, has worked, and will continue to work, as long as it doesn't CREEP itself into "P-somewhat-limited"....

INCLUSION is the key. And it's not that hard to make happen.

After the November SAWs... I'll do some more research and put a few motors on a list to get things started if that would help.

[Doby]

So should we start a new thread about motors that fit the window?

[Darin Jordan]

So should we start a new thread about motors that fit the window?

YES "we" should... TYPE away, my friend!

[Doug Smock]

That's the puzzle piece that IMPBA missed out on that I was referring to. Even if they had to throw the rules completely in the garbage after two seasons they still would have had a couple years of guys turning laps, rubbing elbows, and having a good laugh. Can't put a value on that.

I respectfully disagree Terry.
The IMPBA hasn't missed out on a thing. The classes have been running here and there for what 4 or 5 years.
So there hasn't been a IMPBA FE Nats in many years. Ok, whatever, the guys I know couldn't take the time off to race it anyway.
If there is a motor problem, no problem, we can fix it locally. If we have a group that wants to put on a Nats., all they have to do is post the rules on the "Specialty class(s)" P Limited, RTR, 4 cell that don't smell, whatever.
We don't need a National P Limited rule set. A national rule set on glorified RTRs isn't going to bring more racers to the pond. They have been running a long time The guys that are interested in the classes are / were racing them. I won't even talk about records on those classes.

Just my .02 drivin by some experience and heavy dose of Percocet.

Obviously, your results will vary.LOL

[T.S.Davis]

4 cells that don't smell......bahaha.

We can agree to disagree Doug. Me and Peterson do all the time. Heck, lots disagree with me. It's a national FE pastime.

My thinking is/was that the national rule set match what as many what's popular in multiple pockets guys.
That way, if one pocket hosts a race, the next pocket might already own the same setups. They get together, one thing leads to another, and we have a bunch more model boaters................wait that doesn't read right.

You know what I mean. The limited rules are a benchmark for pockets to reference. Then they can race each other if they want. If we made our own classes, and we have a bunch of times, then the next neighborhood might not have anything that matches what we do.