P-Spec Motors

[T.S.Davis]

It depends on the boat. For boats that like big props, run the bj26 or sv27 motor. If you're running a boat that likes small props, go with a UL-1 motor.

Yep, me too. I haven't had any luck pushing a big fat boat with the UL setup. It just wont do it. The blackjack rips in a fat boat. I'm going to build something around the SV motor for spite now. Maybe OPC will be the one. 2 boats built, 4 to go before spring. haha.

Will mentioned running "by the book". I don't care about "by the book". I want us to run what will put the most boats on the water....and then change the book to represent what's actually doing that. We don't have the numbers to ignore what will get people to want to race. If we wanted to go "by the book" limited sport anything would have died out ages ago.

Brian is right. We never should have called these exhibition classes LSH and LSO. It's confusing. I tried to get people to call them Super Sport Hydro and Super Sport Offshore but guys kept calling them by the old names so I gave up. The term "P spec" sport hydro, hydro, OPC, Offshore, even mono seems to register with most everyone that races now.

[Darin Jordan]

I have a couple of those and one can spin a big tricked wheel with it and no heat issues.
It amazes me that it seem to be pulling more then the 45amps that the ESC offers, but it
does not flinch.

When I tested the SV27 motors on my bench, I found that, while not the most efficient motor, it has a TON of grunt...

Using a stock SV27 ESC, and a 4S1P 4500 mah pack, it would run unloaded at 1565KV... Then, under the same conditions, only using a 7x3.5 airplane prop for a load, it only dropped down to 1545KV... The others dropped more KV under the same load... with the UL1 dropping off significantly more than the rest (of course, it started a lot higher, but still...)...

Also, the SV27 and the BJ26 (and Himax) only pulled around 26-amps under that load... the UL-1 pulled about 39amps under the same load...

The point being that the first three motors can use more prop loading than the UL1, so they favour a larger hull or a hull that LIKES more prop... You CAN achieve the same speeds as the UL-1 with the other motors... you just have to build a PACKAGE that works together... Which is MOST of the fun of this class! It brings Building, Prep, and RACING, all back together as one unit... as opposed to just buying more HP, like the other classes seem to be.

Corey's boats are an excellent example of making the package work! You should see his SV27 powered Vac-u-Pickle!!

[Darin Jordan]

The term "P spec" sport hydro, hydro, OPC, Offshore, even mono seems to register with most everyone that races now.

If we just defined a "P-Spec" power class in the general rules, and made a couple of tweaks to the Sport Hydro, Offshore, and OPC rules, then you'd automatically get:

P-Spec Mono, Sport, Hydro, Offshore, and OPC...

Then LSH and LSO could just remain as they are, and be archived to the back of the book, just like 1/10th Cracker and the rest of the "specialty classes"...

You also would have the power class defined in a SINGLE location, and not have to repeat it under all of the special rules listed (LSH, LSO, OPC, etc...)... Any hull type or specialty class from that point forward could refer to the established power class... (like 1/6th Cracker, etc.) without having to redefine or relist the specs under their special rules... If a motor spec changes, it would automatically be updated for all of them this way...

[T.S.Davis]

Yep, I'm with ya Darin.

I don't think it's an issue for us but I'm going to encourage the MMEU gang to run under what you and I know as P spec. They're already doing it accept for allowing 2p. We've pretty much determined 2P doesn't provide an advantage. A bunch of fuel is just weight you can't get the energy out of withthese motor combos. UL motors in offshore too. We haven't been doing that but I don't think that's an ideal setup anyway. It could work with the right combination but the BJ and SV motors will likely provide the best setups for offshore.

[Ctonez]

Will mentioned running "by the book". I don't care about "by the book". I want us to run what will put the most boats on the water....and then change the book to represent what's actually doing that. We don't have the numbers to ignore what will get people to want to race.

Well said. I think that's the common goal that is shared by both those who want to add motors and those who wish to keep them limited to a select few. Affordable parity seems to be the answer.
In difficult times, cheaper is better for most people. All the options we currently have are relatively cheap, durable, and easy to come by. I think we're (PSFEMBC) all happy with what we currently run as P-Spec.
I think we may have jumped the gun a bit by voting in the Ammo1800, but we shouldn't disallow or discourage the testing of alternatives in my opinion. Some might work, some might not...certainly we'll be discussing it within the club in further depth because allowing advantage is just not "in the spirit" of Spec-anything.
I'll offer to replace my spec SV's motor with the Ammo1800kv and/or the shorter canned 1500kv and race for no points just to see how they compare. Our LSH Class has the best mix of setups (BJ/UL/SV) though, it would also be a good test bed but for the variation in hulls.

cheers,
-Corey

[Ctonez]

Corey's boats are an excellent example of making the package work! You should see his SV27 powered Vac-u-Pickle!!

I know it'll do 2 Laps 1/6 mi. course in 22.67sec.

An observation:
There are 2 classes we run where I see a slight advantage in certain power systems...the Riggers like the UL's rpm. The Tunnels seem to behave similarly from what I've observed. That's fine, I don't run those classes (yet), nor does anyone else with an SV system that I am aware of...pretty sure Darin runs the Proboat ESC/BlackJack in his Tunnel though, and his Tunnel is as fast as those running UL's.

[Brushless55]

When I tested the SV27 motors on my bench, I found that, while not the most efficient motor, it has a TON of grunt...

Using a stock SV27 ESC, and a 4S1P 4500 mah pack, it would run unloaded at 1565KV... Then, under the same conditions, only using a 7x3.5 airplane prop for a load, it only dropped down to 1545KV... The others dropped more KV under the same load... with the UL1 dropping off significantly more than the rest (of course, it started a lot higher, but still...)...

Also, the SV27 and the BJ26 (and Himax) only pulled around 26-amps under that load... the UL-1 pulled about 39amps under the same load...

The point being that the first three motors can use more prop loading than the UL1, so they favour a larger hull or a hull that LIKES more prop... You CAN achieve the same speeds as the UL-1 with the other motors... you just have to build a PACKAGE that works together... Which is MOST of the fun of this class! It brings Building, Prep, and RACING, all back together as one unit... as opposed to just buying more HP, like the other classes seem to be.

Corey's boats are an excellent example of making the package work! You should see his SV27 powered Vac-u-Pickle!!

Awesome, with all this good talk about the SV motor, then I'm glad because I have 3 of them and will use one in my Titan 29 next season...
just not sure what prop to use

[Doug Smock]

If we just defined a "P-Spec" power class in the general rules, and made a couple of tweaks to the Sport Hydro, Offshore, and OPC rules, then you'd automatically get:

P-Spec Mono, Sport, Hydro, Offshore, and OPC...

Then LSH and LSO could just remain as they are, and be archived to the back of the book, just like 1/10th Cracker and the rest of the "specialty classes".

Personally I like "Limited Sport ", Mono, Hydro, OPC ( O/B Tunnel) better.
Sounds cooler donchathink???
And, it will look better on the wood!
Just my buck and a quarter. LOL
Doug

[Darin Jordan]

Personally I like "Limited Sport ", Mono, Hydro, OPC ( O/B Tunnel) better.

I could do that as well... except that you'd have "Limited Sport Sport Hydro" and "Limited Sport Hydro"...

Would look odd amongst all the Ns and Ps and Qs, however...

I think we should rename the whole bunch, but that's just me!

P-Spec makes more sense in our current scheme to me...

[Doug Smock]

LSH as it was is done, here anyway. That's another thing that needs to be addressed in the IMPBA, eventually.
No hurry here, things are working out.
And really the only reason I chimed in on this one is that we would like to see NAMBA and the IMPBA keep similar class structures, even at the club level.

Doug

[highndry]

In our microcosm of a club, that is probably representative of many small groups, we do this:

LSH = AQ (Ul-1, SV) , PB ( BJ) power. Any hull, esc, etc..

LSO = same as above power, offshore course.

P- Spec rigger = same as above power

P Mono = generally accepted P requirements

Q Offshore = generally accepted Q requirements, offshore course.

OPC Spec = Same as LSH power, no other limitations

This structure allows entry level $$ to compete, as well as, those who are more committed dollar wise to air it out.

I understand this structure is probably over-simplified relative to the details ya'll are struggling with but it works for us.

[ray schrauwen]

Just because I can toss a wrench, why not, lol...

I like this puppy, have one on B/O. HK can barely leep them in stock.

Same range of Max amps and Wattage, around 55 amps max and 700-800 watts.

I's just not going to fly because its an outrunner.

Nice 1800-1900 KV motor for $29. Helicopter guys are loving these!

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=9258

[properchopper]

Awesome, with all this good talk about the SV motor, then I'm glad because I have 3 of them and will use one in my Titan 29 next season...
just not sure what prop to use

Todd, I just put the SV 27 motor in my Titan 29 to rig for WW VI LSO & will begin prop testing this week .I'll let you know.

[RandyatBBY]

Geez, You guy's are killing me I want to read all that goes on in my world of RC and the Net, 17 post on this topic alone today! I never get to work without the internet at home and it is shut off until the recessions is over..

[Alfa Spirit]

FSD motors, better than Feigao and not very expensive